Ep. 23 - Ash Wednesday (2002)

[00:00:00] Alright then, keep your secrets. Get that frog out of your pants. I'm the guy. The real guy. Now where do all these movies come from anyway? Just... alright, fuck me. Just clean it up. Fuck it. Gingling. I will take the ring to Mordor. Though, I do not know the way.

[00:00:24] Hello and welcome to episode 23 of The Complete Works Podcast. A deep dive into the career and films of actor Elijah Wood. My name is Mike Smith and joining me on this journey there and back again is my friend, co-host and fellow good son... Mike DiCruccio How'd you do today Mike? Oh, I'm doing great. I'm feeling my Irish side today. I'm excited to talk about just like what happens in bars in Hell's Kitchen in 1983 or whatever. It's gonna be so exciting.

[00:00:51] Yeah, I know this movie does take place in 1983. I don't think the movie does anything to make you believe that it's taking place in 1983. It feels pretty present day to me. But today Mike D, we do have to talk about local legend, Mike D, hometown hero, Valley Stream's own, Ed Burns. Yes, Ed Burns. Local boy made good. He did it. Yeah, so you're familiar with the career of Ed Burns it sounds like, Mike.

[00:01:17] Familiar in that like, he's a guy that was around a lot and stuff and yeah, he's from the hometown and so yeah, anytime he pops up in anything, we're always very excited to be like, do the Leo point? He's like, that's the guy that's Ed Burns. He's from here. Yeah, absolutely. So I think I think today and I will say like I had to look up who Ed Burns was before doing this episode. Like I he's arriving in Save Private Ryan. He's a cool gun. Come on. Yes, that's the thing. I think a lot of people would remember Ed Burns best for his role in Save Private Ryan.

[00:01:46] And like that would be the big thing. But in the mid 90s, he was an indie filmmaker on the rise. That was kind of his big thing. And so he produced, finance directed and starred in the 1995 drama The Brothers McMullen, which was filmed in Valley Stream. Oh, I don't think I knew that. OK, so you haven't seen this movie, Mike. I don't think so. OK, not that I can think of remember off the top of my head, but I'm like aware of it in the like that's the Ed Burns movie, you know? OK, yeah, there you go. But yeah, filmed around Mike D's hometown.

[00:02:14] And once he made that movie, he was able to then get a copy of it to Robert Redford at a press junket. I think Robert Redford was in a press junket for quiz show. Ed Burns like accosted him and gave him a copy of his movie and Redford ended up watching it and then invited him to screen it at the then new relatively new Sundance Film Festival, which, of course, Redford was a founding founded. And that is what launched the career of Ed Burns. The film was picked up by Fox at the film festival and ends up actually being the very first Fox Searchlight release.

[00:02:44] Whoa. Brothers McMullen. Yeah, absolutely. That's crazy. I don't think I knew that. What? I thought he was just a local boy. I didn't know that he was like actually maybe important a little bit. Oh, yeah. You're learning so much about your favorite hometown hero. So we're like this. We're best friends. Yeah. So he followed that movie up with another indie hit called She's the One with Jennifer Anson and Cameron Diaz. And then, man, he just kept cranking out movies.

[00:03:08] So Ed Burns has written and directed 16 feature films and is still making them to this day. None of them have really reached the critical heights of his first two films, and most of them are made for very little money. You get very small theatrical releases. I was looking at some of the budgets on some of these movies, and they're truly like less than ten thousand dollars. Like it's real small scale filmmaking. He did recently release actually a legacy sequel to The Brothers McMullen called The Family McMullen, which went straight to HBO Max.

[00:03:37] So that came out in twenty twenty five. So, yeah, Ed Burns long and story career. He has directed a lot of movies. He's appeared as an actor in a lot of things as well. Saving Private Ryan, most notably, but he's in a lot of movies and kind of the late nineties, early two thousands. He has not appeared as an actor in anything. He hasn't directed since like twenty twelve. I feel like Alex Cross, I think, was the last movie he was in. OK, he didn't make, which is a movie that is based on the novels starring Tyler Perry. Yeah. And speak.

[00:04:07] No, I actually wanted to mention it as I was talking to Mike D right before the podcast. I'm eight months behind perpetually on all my podcasts, as we mentioned frequently. Yeah. And so blank check a podcast very similar to ours, but much more successful. They are doing a series in the films of Martin Scorsese right now. But the series that I am on is their Lynn Ramsey series from back in January and February. I was listening to their episode on You Were Never Really Here literally yesterday after watching today's movie.

[00:04:35] Mm hmm. And they go off on a tangent about the films of Ed Burns and start talking about it and start talking about how like, you know, he however many movies you think Ed Burns has directed. There's so many more of them where it's like, oh, you think, you know, you hear that. And it's like, oh, well, you know, he directed three movies I've heard of. He must have directed like three. I haven't heard of. He's made six. So, no, he's made 16. Right. Right. And they referred to him as the Irish American Tyler Perry, which I thought was a very funny descriptor for it.

[00:05:03] And ironic. The last movie he was in that wasn't his own movie was a Tyler Perry or exactly. Tyler Perry. Exactly. Yeah, that's funny. Yeah. I mean, he's one of those guys. I mean, you know, like I said, hometown Irish, Italian Americans, you know, whatever, blah, blah, blah. That it's always been like, oh, yeah. But like his movies aren't that good, which I think has been more the back half, at least, you know. Sure. It sounds like his first two films. I've never seen enemies of films. So, OK, and it sounds like Brothers McMillan and She's the One are pretty good from what I understand.

[00:05:34] Everything else probably pretty hit or miss. But today, Elijah Wood is in between Lord of the Rings movies, likely had a small break in his schedule to appear in something quick. And since he's in today's film, we've got to talk about Ash Wednesday. Remember, Francis, thou art dust and unto dust thou shalt return. Our father, bless these ashes, which we will use as the mark of our repentance. Bless me, Father, for I have sinned.

[00:06:05] Well, you've got a problem, Francis. Your brother was never to show his face in the neighborhood ever again. So now I got Whitey Smith asking me what you're doing back in the neighborhood, huh? It's not like it's you they're going to kill if they find out. Hey, it's me, it's you, and maybe even Grace. You know what will happen if they see him? Yeah, they'll kill him. And then kill you. She's still beautiful? She's your wife. I don't look at her that way. How am I supposed to face him? I fell in love with you. See, your brother killed my brother.

[00:06:35] You think you're going to make a fool out of me in my own neighborhood? Yeah, I keep expecting someone to put a moment in my head because they found out that I killed their brother, killed their father. All right. Every time I walk around the neighborhood, I see people that remind me of the terrible shit that I did. Now that they spotted Sean, there's going to be more bloodshed and I can't be a part of it anymore. The wages of sin must be paid. All right. So Ash Wednesday stars Elijah Wood as Sean Sullivan,

[00:07:01] a 21 year old who has been missing presumed dead for three years, who suddenly comes back to town. His brother, Francis Sullivan is, of course, by Ed Burns, who is the lead character of the movie. You've also got Rosario Dawson in this movie as Grace. Grace, Elijah, Elijah Wood's wife, who is now in love with Francis. Oliver Platt, who recently has been on The Bear a lot playing Uncle Jimmy. He plays Moran, who wants to kill Elijah Wood.

[00:07:29] Brian Burns, Ed Burns's brother, who also produces Blue Bloods these days. I guess is Blue Bloods still on TV? I think it is. I really couldn't tell you. I feel like Blue Bloods is probably one of those shows that has quietly has like 20 seasons that I don't know about. Yeah. Yeah. No, the only thing I think that's left on TV is 85 spinoffs of the FBI shows and whatever Dick Wolf is doing. The Chicago shows too. Yeah, the Chicago shows. Which are Dick Wolf. Well, that's Dick Wolf. Yeah, that's Dick Wolf. But yeah, Ed Burns's brother, Brian Burns. He's in this movie. He produced Blue Bloods.

[00:07:58] He's Mike Moran, Moran's brother. Pat McNamara from the Daytrippers plays Murphy. Malachi McCourt, who was the Green Party candidate for governor of New York in 2006, lost to whoever won 2006. 2006? Spitzer. I think it was Elliot Spitzer that he lost to. He plays Whitey Smith in this movie. Peter Garrity from Homicide Life on the Street and The Wire plays Uncle Handy. And finally, we've gotten Elijah Wood here, Mike. Do we? We do.

[00:08:27] James Handy, who also appeared in Black and White, plays Father Mahoney in this film. Oh, okay. I was like, where's Kevin Corrigan? He's gotta be in here somewhere. It's crazy that Kevin Corrigan's not in this movie. I know! He would be the secret season of the Complete Works we're doing if he was in another movie we're talking about. It would be a funny bit to just do all the Long Island Boys as a Complete Works season. It's like Kevin Corrigan, Steve Buscemi, Ed Burns, like all those guys. Sounds great, honestly. Yeah, I think that'd be a lot of fun.

[00:08:56] The movie was written and directed by Ed Burns one year after his previous film, Sidewalks of New York, and two years before his next film, Looking for Kitty. His most recent film, Finnegan's Foursome, was released this year on VOD. So yeah, still cranking him out. Just had a new movie coming out back in June. Ash Wednesday was released on October 11th, 2002, and I watched it on October 11th, 2026. Happy 24th anniversary, Ash Wednesday. Holy shit, I just missed.

[00:09:25] I watched October 12th, 2026. Ah, bummer. You could have celebrated with me, Mike. You could have celebrated Ash Wednesday in October. Ah! That's what we're always talking about. Ash Wednesday in October, Christmas in July. Dots and cats living together in mass hysteria. This movie came out in two theaters. Okay. And it opened to number 122 at the box office. You didn't think it went that far, but it does. I was going to say shout out to box office records going all the way down to 122.

[00:09:55] Ah, so yeah, only opened in two theaters. Opening to number three that weekend was Brown Sugar with Taye Diggs and Snellathan. I wasn't going to make you guess that one, Mike, but I will make you guess this one. Opening to number four was an action movie, Jason Statham. Oh, that's tough. Is it a franchise? Is it a sequel? Is it any of that stuff? It is the first film in a franchise. There are a few movies in the series. Oh, man. Um, 2002, Jason Statham leading a, creating a franchise. That's so impossible.

[00:10:25] The only thing I can think of is crank, but that's too early for crank. It's too early for crank. It's not crank. It's kind of the other Jason Statham franchise, which is, I think, I think it's choreographed by Corey Yun. I want to say, doesn't he do the, uh, yeah, I want to say it's Corey Yun. It's one of the Hong Kong guys. Uh, the transporter, uh, came out in 2002, Mike. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The other Jason Statham one. Yeah, you're right. Exactly. Uh, opening to number seven was a white Oleander with Alison Loman and Michelle Pfeiffer opening to number eight.

[00:10:55] I'll make a guess this one, Mike. It's a YA adaptation, uh, of a classic children's book. Um, line the witch in the wardrobe. No, not line the witch in the wardrobe. Uh, it does have a fantasy element. I think a romance element. Uh, I definitely read this book when I was in like sixth grade. I feel like a lot of sixth graders did. It was like a fifth and sixth grade type book. Oh boy. There's so many books like that. I guess that's true. Yeah. The outsiders. Uh, not either of those.

[00:11:23] Uh, it's not, it's not Francis Ford Coppola's the outsiders. Correct. Uh, no tuck everlasting, uh, came out, uh, never in a thousand years would I have gotten to there. I think I've heard of that is where my reaction to that were those. You've never read tuck everlasting. I don't think so. Okay. That was a very popular book when I was a kid. I'm surprised. Uh, opening number nine was the crime thriller knock around guys with a Barry pepper, Vin diesel and Seth green. The other guys from saving forever. Yeah, actually. Right.

[00:11:53] Uh, but number one of the box office, Mike, uh, in its second week, uh, is the second film in a franchise. It's a prequel. It's a prequel. Yes. But I'm saying it's technically it's the third film in the franchise, but the second featuring like the iconic actor playing this role. I feel like every episode I'm like, it's one of the fast and the furious movies. It is not. It's the third movie that technically is a prequel. Uh, you're, you're right.

[00:12:21] Uh, it's, it's not a fast and furious. Although actually this movie is sort of a remake of the first movie in this franchise. The previous movie was a big Oscar contender, big Oscar winner. Uh, it won best. The, the previous movie won best picture at the Oscars and best actor and best actress. I got it. I don't know, man. I can't think of anything. This movie features a guy who is in black and white, uh, or was directed by a guy who's in black and white.

[00:12:54] You're going to make me guess a Brett Ratner movie. I feel like I've given you all the clues here. Uh, Mr. Policeman, I can't put them together. I don't, I don't know. Uh, Brett Ratner, of course was the director of red dragon, Mike. Oh my God. Red dragon. Of course the Hannibal Lecter films don't exist. I like Hannibal Lecter film. The sequel to silence, the lambs, technically a prequel to silence and the lambs. Yeah. That is also a remake of manhunter. Right. Uh, you see where the dots are connecting. It's all coming together. Yeah.

[00:13:23] You did give me all the clues. Uh, if you told me Ray fines, maybe, maybe. Maybe I would've got there. So I've actually never seen red dragon. I didn't know. I didn't know. He's the, he's the guy. He's the red dragon. I think. Oh, okay. Hey, good for him. Uh, I love Ray fines. Dr. Kelson himself. Uh, still the, uh, still the Mike award winner for best actor for 28 years later, the bone temple in 2026. Uh, true. But, uh, yes, red dragon was number one at the box office. Also in the top 10 or sweet home, Alabama, my big fat Greek wedding.

[00:13:52] And it's 26th week at the box office. Uh, the tuxedo with Jackie Chan, uh, and Barbara shop. I saw the tuxedo also. I, I definitely, I'm not sure if I owned the tuxedo on DVD, but I definitely had a DVD of tuxedo at some point. Yeah. Jennifer Love Hewitt to connect it to last episode, right? Isn't she in there? Oh, right. Yeah. Thumbelina herself. Uh, the, uh, the IMD plot synopsis for Ash Wednesday reads Ash Wednesday is set in the Manhattan of the early 1980s and it's about, and it's about a pair of Irish American

[00:14:21] brothers, Burns and Wood who become embroiled in a conflict with the Irish mob. Uh, so might D I mean, that is, you know, exactly what it is. Embroiled. They sure get, they sure do. Uh, so might D going into Ash Wednesday, of course, uh, your, uh, hometown hero, Ed Burns, uh, my best friend, your best friend, a good friend of the podcast. Uh, what were you expecting from this movie and, uh, what are your overall thoughts on Ash Wednesday? Yeah. I mean, like I said, I don't think I've, I mean, I've probably seen some other Ed Burns

[00:14:50] movies or actually probably not. I movies that he wrote in direct. I don't know. I'd have to like look at the list and figure it out, but you kind of get the vibe, you know, he's, uh, you know, it's set in Manhattan. It's whatever. It's going to be this crime thing. It's going to be talky. It's going to be an independent drama kind of thing. It's going to be probably people yelling curses at each other and stuff. And it's all those things basically. Yeah. It's that's kind of vibe. But I think there's just something about this movie that doesn't come together.

[00:15:16] And I don't know if it's just cause it's like boring or I think one of the letterboxd reviews I read was like, oh, it's the same scene for 90 minutes. And that's basically the vibe where, you know, we have this, this prequel, this, uh, not prequel, cold open. Um, where it's these guys at the bar and they're talking about doing something and Elijah would reaches into the cooler and pulls out a gun and shoots them. And, and I was like, holy shit. And the only two names before the credits before that, and the, for the title card are

[00:15:43] Edward, Edward Burns and, uh, Elijah would. Yeah. And then he's the cold open. And I was like, holy shit. Is he like the main character of this movie? That's crazy. And then he's gone. And you're like, nah, for the context of this movie, I was really worried. Yeah. For the context of like this podcast, like I was, uh, Elijah was in that cold open. And then, uh, the movies about like him searching for Elijah would for the right, like a half hour. It's like, oh, where is he? He's like going around town. He's like, Hey, have you seen my brother or whatever? He's dead.

[00:16:10] And I, I really thought it was like, oh man, this is like in between Lord of the Rings movies, Elijah woods here for the beginning and the end of the movie. Like that's going to be, uh, and he does show up like maybe like a half hour in and then he becomes like a bigger part of it. But like, there's a stretch of the movie where I'm like, Elijah was barely going to be in this thing. Um, yeah. And, and you find out, right? Like you said, uh, somebody has apparently seen Sean, right? That's his character's name.

[00:16:36] I think, uh, has seen Sean in the neighborhood last night and he died three years ago. So like, what the hell is going on, Francis? What's going, what's happening? And so then it's, it's, uh, uh, Ed Burns, like you said, for 30, whatever minutes, uh, walking around their neighborhood, going to different bars, different stores, different people, different characters, local figures and being like, my brother's dead. What do you mean? You saw him last night? Uh, kind of thing. And it's that, it's just like, okay, yeah, we get it. Like, come on.

[00:17:05] The same piano track playing over every scene as well. Uh, it's terrible. The music is terrible. Um, and then, yeah, he does, Elijah would does show up. Uh, and it turns out that they, um, you know, have staged his death following the events of the cold open where he killed some rival gang member people or something, uh, disturbed the mob piece. Um, and so they faked his death and got him out of town. And, you know, now that he's reappeared, old rivalries are coming, uh, coming to a head

[00:17:34] and, you know, uh, uh, things like that are going to happen. You know, they get embroiled in a plot with our Irish mob on that level. It's kind of like, Oh, this is sort of interesting. It's sort of a character piece, you know, the different relationships between the different, you know, uh, factions and the mob. And, and it's, it's, this is whiteys neighborhoods you see, and like all that stuff. And, uh, and you know, Rosario Dawson's pretty great, I think for her limited role in it. Uh, so like, yeah, ultimately it's just kind of boring. I think is like the main sin of this movie.

[00:18:03] I think if it wasn't the same conversation, the same 22nd piano track, like it might, might have, um, a little bit of like energy or tension or like, uh, not that I'm looking at, not that I think it's going to be like a thriller necessarily, but like, you know, there might be some like, Ooh, mystery what's going on. Right. Um, but it's just kind of the same, same beat for 90 minutes. Um, and luckily it's only 90 minutes, I think in and out it's kind of cool, you know, for the context of like a hometown boy makes good.

[00:18:33] Um, I didn't realize he's got his movie is the first Fox search light movie. That's pretty cool for Ed Burns. yeah, it's like, whatever. I wasn't super jazzed about it. Didn't have that great a time, but also we've seen worse. Oh, we've certainly seen worse. Yeah. We just talked about Tom Thumb and Thumbelina last week. So, you know, this is an upgrade from that. Absolutely. You know, I, I think this is a, I I'm with you, Mike. I think this is basically like, I hesitate to even call it like, okay.

[00:18:59] I don't think it's even that necessarily, but it's like, it's, there's something here. There's like a kernel of something here. Yeah. I think it could be, uh, explored a little better. Maybe I was reading about the background of this movie a little bit. And, uh, from what I understand, the budget got slashed like significantly right before it was supposed to start shooting. Uh, which I do think is why most of the stuff you see in the movie is interior shots. Uh, because one of the big things about the period setting is if you want to make it 1983 New York city, you're going to have to have nice and eighties cars and the, you know,

[00:19:28] all that kind of stuff like out there and in, in the streets. Uh, and I think if they were able to pull that off, maybe the illusion would have been sold a little bit better. Uh, so there is that. Um, yeah, I will say, I think Ed Burns actually, he's really good in it. I think he's given a really good performance as Francis. I think he's really solid. I think, I think is that, is that the thing? Like if he had just been an actor and hadn't been like, I must write and direct all my own things. Could he have been great?

[00:19:56] Like, yeah, like he's great in the other stuff I've seen him in like that. And he's a good actor for sure. Absolutely. Uh, but it's just like, it's the same conversation every time. Yeah. It's a, it's a little tough to, uh, kind of, I don't know, play that. Yeah. I don't know. I think it, it does the job to a degree. I think there is because I, I feel like I'm just like, oh yeah, I enjoy crime movie set in New York. So like baseline, I, you know, I, I feel like I baseline kind of enjoyed Ash Wednesday just in that front.

[00:20:25] You know, I think Ed Burns is really good in his role. I think, uh, you know, it's got a colorful cast of like, you know, Irish American gangster characters. And those are always just, you know, they're, they're mostly stock types, but they're pretty fun stock types, uh, in this movie. And I think, uh, the stuff between him and Rosario Dawson's actually pretty compelling, all that stuff. Uh, but kind of getting into Elijah Wood in the movie. Uh, you know, I think he, Elijah Wood is giving a pretty good performance. But I think he is wildly miscast, uh, in Ash Wednesday. Yeah.

[00:20:54] You can put baby faced, just do a little cherub of a guy, little boy, uh, Elijah Wood next to all these, like just meathead round red faced Italian, uh, Irish, like mobster types. Yeah. And then be like, he's the same guy. Like he's there, he's his brother. Uh, like, I don't know how old Ed Burns is in this, but he feels like he could be his father. Uh, cause Elijah Wood looks so young to the point where I was like, is he a child?

[00:21:21] Is he supposed to be like a high school child, like student? And he says like, you know, I should be graduating college now or something. So you're like, okay, so you're like you said, 21 or whatever. Yeah. They, they referenced that like Ed Burns mentions that Elijah was 21 at one point. Um, but he's been gone for three years and he has a wife already like Rosario, like he and Rosario Dawson are married. Right. Uh, so obviously he got married, I guess at 17 or 18. Uh, and Rosario Dawson has a kid. Uh, and I think the heavy implication is that it's actually Francis's kid as opposed

[00:21:50] to Elijah Woods. Uh, that was my assumption. Cause Elijah would hadn't met the kid, right? That, that was a, like when they see, when they reunite at the end of the movie, like he's meeting the kid for the first time kind of thing. Uh, so I think the heavy implications that it's actually Francis kid as opposed to his. Uh, so there is that, but yeah, no, I think, uh, Elijah would supposed to, I mean, Elijah would is 21 years old roughly at this point, maybe a couple of years older, but yeah, it just feels completely out of place with, uh, with this movie.

[00:22:19] He's also the only one without a New York accent, uh, which is weird. Uh, yeah. I was, I was afraid he was going to try, uh, cause he's such a Midwest boy. Uh, but no, you can't next to Ed Burns. Loy, he sounds like you just seem like a terrible, like an idiot. Um, so yeah, it just feels like, you know, and they do the, like, you know, you were supposed to be the smart one that was going to get out of this life and all this stuff, like to make him like a little bit different from all the other hoodlums, you know? But it just doesn't really fit at all.

[00:22:49] He doesn't feel like if, imagine if this was Kevin Corrigan, you know, like, oh man, that'd be great. I think Kevin Corrigan might've been too old for it at this point. You know, if the character has to be 21 years old, 21. Yeah. But, uh, yeah, no, I think Elijah would is, is fine in this role. It's just like, it just feels like really tonally out of place. Yeah. Uh, with what that character is and what he's doing. Um, but yeah, a lot, essentially the, uh, the plot of the movie is that Elijah Woods character, uh, has been gone for three years. His death.

[00:23:18] And it was the idea to like, get him out of this town, get him out of this life. And so he can make something of himself, go to college, all that. Um, but he comes back because, uh, he wants to see his wife. He wants to get her and move out to the coast. Right. Right. Yeah. He's been living in on a farm in Texas for three years or something. And he wants to get his life back kind of thing. Yeah. And because he can't go a night without getting a drink or something, or he wants to, I'm cooping cooped up in here for too long. Damn it. Uh, he's gotta go. I wanted to see people I knew, whatever. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:23:45] Uh, and he goes out and gets spotted, or he goes to a bar he used to go to or something. And they're like, that's Sean. Uh, and that kind of kicks off the whole, the whole thing, you know? Yeah. So, uh, how do you think this fits into the Elijah Wood roles we've seen so far, Mike? Well, it's very unlike Thumbelina. So, which is now our metric. It's, uh, yeah. Would you say the apartment above the bar is a tree house? I don't really think so.

[00:24:12] That's kind of, that's a bit of a stretch, um, where he's hiding out. Yeah. That's a bit of a stretch. Um, but I guess it's sort of like, uh, uh, I'm trying to think of like other crime movies you've seen, you know, chain of fools. Cause these people have definitely seen better days. Absolutely. I've seen better days. Absolutely. Um, but I, and it's kind of really, it's, it's, I guess most like chain of fools if I'm thinking about it, but, uh, yeah, I mean, chain of fools obviously a much more like comedic

[00:24:40] movie, but, uh, in terms of like, you know, uh, different criminal factions kind of all fighting over the same thing sort of deal. Right. Uh, then I think, yeah, Ash Wednesday and chain of fools makes sense. But I guess that's kind of really it that I could think of off the top of my head. What do you got? I should, you know, it's like you asked me this question every episode and somehow I never think to think about it before you ask me. Uh, I mean, has there been any other like kind of major New York movie in the, uh, in the Elijah Wood filmography that we've talked about so far? Hmm.

[00:25:08] Where you could say like maybe New York is like a black, yeah. True. Black and white is, yeah. New York, big New York movie for sure. Yes. Uh, but yeah, sorry to cut you off, Mike. You're saying that New York's like a character in the story. That's exactly what I was saying. You're right. Um, that's kind of really it that I could think of. Yeah. No, I think New York is, uh, uh, black and white is the only other like major New York movie in here. Uh, the ice storm is Connecticut. That's true. The suburbs of New York. I think there might be some upstate New York in the ice storm actually. Uh, don't they go, don't they go to the city?

[00:25:38] Doesn't it go to the city to, uh, yeah. It's where Katie Holmes apartment is or whatever. Right. Exactly. So there's, there's some New York stuff happening here. Um, but yeah, this is, this one is very much like this is New York, baby. This is New York, baby. Hell's kitchen in the eighties. Hell's kitchen. Daredevil is swinging across the streets, uh, somewhere around here. Um, but yeah, no, otherwise, yeah, it's, it's feels pretty, uh, isolated from the rest of the Elijah Wood filmography, but it does feel like, you know, he's, he gets co top billing with Ed Burns.

[00:26:07] Uh, he is kind of the secondary main character. And at this point, you know, Ash Wednesday comes out, it's a year after fellowship of the ring. So the Lord of the rings is in full effect right now. Right. Elijah Wood is like the, this is the biggest, his star has ever been. He's like, you know, the biggest possible name, uh, that he's going to be. Uh, and so for this to come out, you know, it's, it's one of those things where like, Oh, if this movie were a little bit better, it probably would have gotten a bigger push, uh, as opposed to coming out in two theaters, uh, sandwiched in between fellowship and two towers. Right. Yeah.

[00:26:37] I mean, I wonder what happened. I mean, you know, that's just the, the kind of mystery of movies. Sometimes his funding gets pulled or whatever, but like, yeah, I wonder why, I mean, resulting in the, in the, the, the budget being cut like that. And that's how that could affect, you know, the movie that the, the result of the movie. Yeah, absolutely. But, uh, what are the scenes or moments in Ash Wednesday that, uh, stand out to you, Mike? What do you want to talk about? Um, well, I kind of love Oliver Platt in this. Sure. She's just a bastard.

[00:27:04] Uh, and, uh, yeah, the, the kind of unraveling of the mystery sort of around what happened in that cold open where Elijah would kills these three guys in the bathroom of the bar, uh, uh, because he overhears them. I think planning to hurt their brother, hurt Francis. I think they're going to, they're going to kill Francis. Yeah. For whatever reason, I don't totally remember why. Um, yeah, they are going to kill Francis. Elijah would overhears it. I don't know why they're talking about their plan in front of Elijah would who's right there. At their bar. Yeah. Like what's happening.

[00:27:34] Um, but so Elijah would overhears that and he gets a gun and he kills those guys. And then the cold open is him going like, he kills those guys and then goes to the, uh, the church. To confess. Yeah. Yeah. It has to confess. Forgive me, father. I have sinned. And then it's like three years later. Whoa. What's happened? Yeah. Uh, and so you kind of have to pick up like what's been happening from there, but like, yeah, Elijah would suddenly back in town and Francis trying to figure out what's going on. Right. And he, and so he knows that Elijah would not actually dead, but to the end, he and

[00:28:04] the father, the priest. Yeah. Uh, are the only ones who actually know. Right. That Elijah would not dead. Uh, the rest of the town, including Rosario Dawson, Elijah was why I thinks he's dead. Yeah. So, uh, but if I, if turns out that one of those people was Oliver Platt's brother, uh, yes. So now it's like, well, if your brother is not dead, then my debt hasn't been paid is kind of like the big climactic confrontation at the end. But just every time he pops up as like one of these rival, you know, under bosses or

[00:28:32] whatever of the Irish mob is just funny. I don't know. It's just cool. He, I mean, he's just a great mobster. He's a, he's a fits that role so well for sure. Yeah. Um, and then, yeah, they could be, he confronts Francis at the very end in the bar where he says that he said like, that was my brother that got killed, blah, blah, blah, and all this stuff. And, uh, you know, you think Francis is going to get it. Uh, and at the last second, that stranger that's been in the corner of the bar comes out of the bathroom shooting and, uh, saves Francis and turns out he's been a plant the whole time to, to protect him.

[00:29:02] Um, well, Francis does die at the end, right? Doesn't he? Well, yeah, but not after, after the scene, he, he realizes basically, so they, they eventually, um, like ferret Elijah Wood and, uh, Rosario Dawson out to a house upstate or something where they're going to get on a bus and disappear with the priest. Like, you know, whatever they successfully hide them again. Um, but he realizes that like people had seen him now, they're never going to stop looking. So he puts on the pea coat and the beanie, like he was wearing when he was spotted.

[00:29:31] So he looks like Elijah Wood from the back. And that's what happens. He goes out onto the street and gets gunned down by some other mob guy. I don't really even remember who or why that guy is on the roof with the gun, but he is, uh, and, and kills him. So, um, he does end up dying, but you know, it's like a, so, you know, older brother sacrificing himself to, to save the younger brother kind of thing. Right. Which, you know, like, Oh, Catholic drama, you know, Ashway. Yeah. I mean this movie is very, is very much steeped in that like Irish Catholic. Uh, yeah, they all have the ashes, you know?

[00:30:01] Yeah. I mean, yes. The movie takes place on Ash Wednesday. Uh, and I believe the entire, the entire movie takes it's, it's all in one day, right? It's all just Ash Wednesday. Uh, which after a while I was like, man, they're covering a lot of ground in the city. Uh, so in this one single day, there's a lot going on. It does start at like dawn though. Like it starts really early. Um, that is true. Um, but it is funny that like, uh, you know, everybody has the ashes on, right? Like the entire movie, everybody has the ashes from Ash Wednesday on their foreheads.

[00:30:29] Uh, and I feel like the Ash consistency, uh, is kind of all over the place for a lot of these characters. Well, or they keep going back to the church to get them reapplied. Like I don't know what. Yeah. That's what I was going to say. That's my one complaint as a, as a Catholic school boy. You know, we all got the ashes on Ash Wednesday at school. Got to do it. Yes. Got to do it. And they're never an actual cross. They're a smudge of a thumbprint. Um, but everyone has a perfect cross and they last two hours. Uh, and then it just, you sweat it off. Like it's gone.

[00:30:58] Uh, you know, like, and, but no, everyone has them for the full 24 hours and a perfect cross. It's very funny. Yep. I was like, Oh, Ed Burns, you're, you're faking it. How could you do? You know, you knew. Yeah. No, I think all the characters are going back to the church every couple of hours to get them reapplied. And that's what's happening. I think you're right. That's the deeply Catholic way. Um, but, uh, yeah, no, I think other scenes, I mean, again, I liked, uh, the kind of chemistry

[00:31:24] between Ed Burns and Rosario Dawson and the kind of their story, uh, the way that it's kind of set up where, uh, you know, finally after about a half hour of Ed Burns, like going around town, asking what's going on. Like, Oh, you saw, you thought you saw Sean. He's dead. That can't possibly be true. He goes back to his apartment and can tell Sean's there and just says like, all right, come out. What are you doing? And Elijah Wood comes out. It's like, what are you doing around town for? What are you doing back here? All that stuff. Uh, and in that scene, they, like Elijah woods, like, are you fucking my wife?

[00:31:54] Like, what do you, you know, all that stuff. It's like, what are you talking about? It like that for her? She's your wife. What are you talking about? Uh, and then of course he is. Uh, uh, and so, yeah, I like the, uh, the chemistry between him or Rosario Dawson. Like, uh, you know, there's a bit where like she, she's talking about, uh, like he has to reveal to her that Elijah Wood is actually alive. Uh, but she takes surprisingly well. Uh, it's like surprise upset about it, but upset. But surprise, but like gets past that surprise pretty quickly. Pretty quickly. Yeah. Um, but it's like, but I'm in love with you.

[00:32:23] And it's like, ah, but you gotta go. Yeah. You know, his wife. Um, and so yeah, they end up doing this whole plan to get them out of the city, uh, before, you know, the mob finds out that they're there. Yeah. I think that, I think that's all good. I like the priest character. That, that performance is really good. Father Mahoney. Yeah. Father Mahoney is just, uh, is just in it. You know, he, he, there's, there's like an implication. They, oh, they kind of like talk about like their, the Sullivan's father was like a mob guy or something. And, and that's why like whitey protects them.

[00:32:53] The, you know, the mob boss of the neighborhood, like, yep. Protects them. And like, I'm doing this cause of who your father was kind of thing. And like, uh, and the same thing for the priest. Uh, but I think, I think he, you know, I like his character. He sort of gets, uh, roped into this sort of against his will. Right. Because Elijah would comes and confesses to him and after he's killed those people, uh, but he knows what's going to happen if, if he's left to, you know, fend for himself. That's part of his whole, like, you know, mission throughout the movie is like, you know, after, after this, I'm done, you know, kind of thing.

[00:33:23] Uh, but I liked him. He's good. Yeah. And I feel like we already hit kind of all the major bullet points. Cause every time, like we talk about something like this where it's like, okay, yeah, no, the wife finds out and now that they have to figure this out. Then it's like another 20 minutes of Ed Burns going to a different location, talking to somebody else, the same piano score is playing. And it's like, Oh, Sean's not alive. What are you talking about? That goes to the next location. Sean's not alive. What are you talking about? Yeah, exactly.

[00:33:51] It's like a, it's like a not manic after hours, you know? Cause it's the same, you know, one crazy night in Manhattan or one crazy day in Manhattan thing, but it's just like slow contemplative piano music version of after hours. Um, and then, yeah, no, the movie kind of just continues from there. They get, uh, Elijah Wood and Rosario Dawson out of town. I like their reunion scene, uh, towards the end where they get in the van and he meets

[00:34:18] the kid, uh, who, uh, he believes to be his son. And they, the movie never like outright says that it's, uh, Francis's son. Maybe it is, uh, Elijah Wood's kid, but I think the implication being that like, Oh, Francis and Rosario Dawson have been together for three years or whatever. I think the implication is that it's actually Francis's. Yeah. I'll be honest. I wasn't paying enough attention to have picked up on that, but it makes sense that that could be in the movie for sure. But also like could be why they got married at 18, 17 or whatever, you know, if she was pregnant. No, I like that scene too. That's a good scene. Um, I forget.

[00:34:48] Oh, I was going to say, I like the, like their plan is like, he's got a, uh, Ed Burns has like a girl he knows out, like out in Brooklyn. And they'll never follow us to Brooklyn. Like it's so funny. Might as well be Timbuktu over there, you know? Yeah, exactly. And then they do follow them to Brooklyn. There's a shootout and all this stuff. It's yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I like how kind of, how much of a dummy Elijah Woods character is, uh, throughout the whole movie too.

[00:35:17] It's just, it's kind of funny. Uh, cause you know, the whole reason this is happening is cause he couldn't, he had to go out and have a drink. He had to go to, and he went to the same bar he used to go to. Right. It's like, ah, nobody knew me over there. I'm fine. It's like, no, I knew you, man. They saw you. They saw you immediately. Yeah. Uh, so I, I like, uh, him being a dummy and like how much that like weighs on Francis to be like, ah, what do I gotta like now I have to deal with all this. Uh, it's very, very fun. But, uh, ultimately, I mean, it's also got like the breaking back Mexico color filter on it. Yeah.

[00:35:47] The whole movie is very yellow. Uh, yeah. Which I maybe is to make it look like an eight, you know, it looks it's old times. It's yellow. It's sapientone. Yeah. This is what the eighties looks like. Exactly. The smog ridden hell's kitchen. Um, but, uh, yeah, ultimately it's kind of just like too boring, I think to really be like pretty good or interesting or any of that stuff, which, uh, is a shame. There's the pieces are there. I think Ed Burns again, I think he's given a really good performance. Actually, he's very good in it.

[00:36:15] Uh, but, uh, yeah, it just feels like it's, it's a little bit less than, uh, what it could be, uh, which is a bummer, but, uh, that's kind of what I think we were both expecting from this movie. And so kind of, yeah, that's Ash Wednesday, baby. Yeah. It is. It is fun though, that he's basically like every older brother I know is just every IRL friend I'd have from Long Island to this area. Yeah. Absolutely. It's like Ed Burns. Yeah.

[00:36:43] I mean, this takes place in hell's kitchen, so it wasn't filmed in your hometown. Um, but, uh, did it feel authentic to the New York experience, Mike, uh, growing up in that area? It felt like a betrayal that it wasn't set in Long Island or in Queens. It should be in Valley Stream. Yeah. It should be on Long Island, but, or, or Queens at least cause Ed Burns is the most Queens human that's ever lived. Yeah. Is there a heavy Irish mafia in Valley Stream? Uh, Not that I'm aware of. I hope not. I don't think so. In 1983 though, who knows? Uh, 83. Yeah, absolutely.

[00:37:11] I mean, like we mentioned, uh, I think we mentioned it last week or two, whatever movie Kevin Corrigan was in, I guess we see black and white chain of fools chain of fools. Oh yeah. Kevin, like everybody in Long Island has like a good fella story who was growing up around 1990 because either they knew the hills in some capacity or they were around when the movie was filming. It's just like, it's, you know, if you, I talked to any of my extended relatives and they all have like at least one good fella story, uh, which is always fun. Um, but all right. I think that's as Wednesday, Mike. I mean, I think we've covered it. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:37:39] I mean, it's a pretty, a pretty small scale movie in general. So if there's not a ton to unpack necessarily, but, uh, yeah, that's, that's Ash Wednesday. We did it. Go get your ashes, I guess. Yeah. Celebrate Ash Wednesday in October. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Do you think if you went to the church now and was like, Hey, could we do the ashes? They would do it. I think they would curse you and throw holy water on you and throw you out. No, no, uh, no, I don't think they would. They wouldn't do it. Yeah.

[00:38:08] It's not a specific timeframe. That's the first day of Lent. That's when Lent starts. Yeah. No, there it is. Uh, I have not done the ashes since I was a kid. Uh, but yeah, yeah, I, I assume they still do them. I'm assuming that tradition hasn't died. I know we have a woke Pope, but he's not that woke. How funny would that be if they're just like first thing in Ash Wednesdays out? Just, you know, do you know how much of a pain it is to get those ashes ready?

[00:38:38] It's a lot. It's a lot going on. Uh, all right. Letterboxd reviews for Ash Wednesday. I got a three star review here from Will Matias, which reads, I appreciate that Elijah was the only one here with no New York accident. And also that there was only room in the budget for one song on the soundtrack. Yeah. Although there was, they do play two, uh, what's the songs? They play radar love by golden earring in the prologue and the opening bit. Yeah. And then I think they play, is there a Skynyrd song in there somewhere?

[00:39:08] Is that no, it's a grand funk railroad song. Okay. Um, I can't remember, but it's, I did notice there was like the two songs that are not the piano track are like classic rock. Like, you know, yeah. Staples. Yeah. There you go. Uh, here's the two and a half star review from will pig, which reads it is Ash Wednesday or should I say ass Wednesday? LMAO. No, just playing. But if you're looking for a GTA mission cut scene filled with excessive or repetitive

[00:39:34] dialogue, jumping from one location to another, then boy, do I have the flick for you? Uh, yeah. Only true gripe is a lot of the acting is not good and most of the writing is bad. It also has a lot of gun tease in it, but some familiar faces keep the movie just entertaining enough. Yeah. There's a lot of dudes like opening their jacket to show up holster of a gun or a, you know, a handle or whatever. Yes. Yeah, that is true. Before eventually there's a shootout in Brooklyn. Yes. And I got one last review here.

[00:40:02] It's a two star review from Corey Donovan, which reads was overexcited by the cold open that had my brain firing off the thought of damn this like this is like a sweetheart collaborate with your average Irish American. Uh, which is interesting. I mean, that cold open is I think stylistically different than the rest of the movie. It just feels like it's, it's, you know, crazier, I guess. And it feels like you're about to watch something more exciting. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I guess you're right. But sweetheart, that's a wild pull.

[00:40:34] Uh, that is a wild pull. You're right. Uh, but I, because we did the Michelle Yoss season, I was like, ah, sweetheart, let's say, yeah, let's have you in there. Yeah. Um, but there you go. That is Ash Wednesday. Mike D. Uh, where can we find you online this week? You can find me at MD film blog on a letterbox in blue sky. You can, uh, donate to support the show on our Kofi page, Kofi.com slash Mike and Mike pods, where you can donate $50 and pick a topic on the bonus episodes on Mike and Mike go to the movies. You got a movie.

[00:41:01] You want us to watch that stars Ed Burns that he didn't write and directs. What Ed TV is he in that? I think, uh, is he the guy in that? I can't remember. I was just pulling up the Ed Burns, uh, filmography actually. Let me see the guy from definite. Maybe I don't remember. Uh, I think he's already Ed. He can't be an Ed TV. Uh, uh, I don't see, I don't see Ed TV in here, but he's a, I mean, he could make us watch one of the first two Ed Burns movies, brothers, or she's the one, uh, saving private Ryan.

[00:41:30] Uh, we've never done an episode on that'd be fun. The holiday he's in the holiday. Sure. Yeah. One missed call. Uh, 27 dresses is I'm just looking at like looking for movies I've heard of. Yeah. Friends with kids. I saw that in theaters. It's pretty good. It's fun. Okay. Uh, Alex cross. Oh man on a ledge or the movie with the man on a ledge. Yeah. I think I do remember that. It's with Sam Worthington and uh, Elizabeth banks. I think. Yes. Yeah. Uh, I never saw it, but I remember seeing the trailer and being like, that title is accurate.

[00:42:00] There is a man on a ledge. Yeah, for sure. But he's actually like, he's a bank robber or something. And he's pretending to be a guy on a ledge to like, yeah. Like Elizabeth banks. Let's try and talk him down. It's like a police officer. And he's, uh, but she doesn't know he's a bank robber. Something's going on there. It's something crazy. Biggest double feature phone booth and man on ledge. Um, that'd be great. He's also in four episodes of entourage. We could do the, uh, he's got big entourage energy. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. He's in that show.

[00:42:26] The Ed burns episodes of entourage exclusively, a show I've never watched. So it'd be fun to just in isolation. Watch those four. It sounds great. Um, but you can do that on our coffee page, coffee. Yeah. Slash Mike and Mike pods. And if you would like merch, we have merch available on our red bubble, Mike and Mike pods. Red bubble.com. That's right. You can find me online at Emma Smith film blog on Twitter and blue sky, Mike Smith film on letterbox radio, Mike sandwich, Instagram. Thanks so much. Listen to the complete works. I'm Mike since my decree show. Don't forget to rate and review the show on Apple podcast or any other podcast app.

[00:42:56] And if you want to contact us, uh, you can ski that is a blue sky. I complete works pod. Also go to Instagram. Same thing. You can find the rest of our podcast and rapture press alongside many other podcasts, what kinds of comp books and movie news and all that good stuff. Our theme song was created by Kyle Cullen. You can reach your own podcast themes at Kyle's podcast themes, gmail.com. And our logo was designed by Mac V or at fearless guard on blue sky. Next week, Mike, we are riding along with the ends as we return to middle earth in the Lord of the rings, the two towers.

[00:43:26] Wow. It's here already. I'm so excited to go to war with the ends. Yes, absolutely. Well, the answer on our side, aren't they? Oh, you're saying go to war with the ends as if like there are allies. Yeah. Alongside the end alongside the ends. Yeah. Well, you made it sound like we were fighting the end. I did. You're right. Okay. I did. You're right. But yeah, we'll be talking about Helm's deep. We'll be talking about the ends and all the other things happening in Lord of the Rings, the two towers. Talk about Gollum. Gollum is a big part of me. Yeah.

[00:43:55] And the search for him. Yes. Which you'll eventually get to next year on complete works in 2027, which I think we will have caught up to present day. Elijah would by the time hunt for Gollum comes out. Okay. That's exciting. I was wondering how many movies he's got and how far away we are. Cause we're at 23. I mean, I know we're in three. I want to say there's like 50 to 60 something. So I, I think manageable. Yeah. Relatively manageable. So yeah, by this time next year, we should be finished with the Elijah Wood season.

[00:44:25] Okay. So perfect. Yeah. Can't wait. All right. All right. Next week, Lord of the Rings, two towers. Remember to check out other podcasts, but might go to the movies for all kinds of other movie related stuff, including recent releases, ranked lists, general discussions, and a lot more. Thanks so much for listening guys. Join us next time. Would you?