Let's Rank Coen Brothers Characters! (Guest: Nick Wermuth)

[00:00:00] Let's get together, talk about the movies that we saw this week.

[00:00:04] We'll have discussions, talk film news, we'll laugh a lot, and act like eats.

[00:00:07] Sometimes we'll have a guest or two sometimes it's just the two of us.

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[00:00:12] I can't buy go to the movies.

[00:00:17] I can't buy go to the movies.

[00:00:22] Yeah!

[00:00:25] You have chosen wise. insult. I think also the worst part about that is you're revealing before God and the internet that we still record this with Skype. Yeah, I'm sorry everyone. Yeah, we're not sophisticated enough for Zoom. You know, Zoom costs money. We're not. We don't have dollars enough to do it on Zoom. Exactly. Yeah. Now we do things on Skype I think the Shoho, Shoe era, right? Is that what it is? So that's like, you know, 14 of the old Godzilla movies that go from like 1954 through 1978 or something. I've watched maybe six or seven of them. It's one of those things where like every once in a while, I'm like, all right, it's time to watch the next one in that box. Really savoring those Godzilla movies.

[00:03:00] But the reason you wanted to do that is of course because Godzilla minus one just came

[00:03:04] out.

[00:03:05] I've seen it.

[00:03:06] I think it's fantastic.

[00:03:07] I think you saw it twice.

[00:03:08] Am I right? still be around next weekend. Also, it seems like it just keeps word of mouth getting extended longer and longer. So yeah, I still have the hope yet for me to see it in theaters. Yeah, it seems to be doing really well. Apparently, I didn't realize this was the plan, but I guess it was originally only supposed to be out for a single weekend or like one week. And then it was gonna get pulled from theaters. But because it did so well and because it's been so highly acclaimed,

[00:04:21] people have been coming out for Godzilla-1

[00:04:23] and so they've extended its run.

[00:04:25] And so if you haven't seen Godzilla-1 yet,

[00:04:27] cannot recommend enough. fun was this idea that you had to rank Cohen Brothers characters, not the movies. You didn't want to do it. Let's rank Cohen Brothers movies. You wanted to rank characters in Cohen Brothers movies. Yes. I feel like when you rank the movies, it can get pretty argumentative because I feel like every time I watch a Cohen Brothers movie, I'm like, well, that's got to be the best one until I put on another one.

[00:05:42] I had that issue last night because I watched't there. The other wasn't there. Yeah, it wasn't there. Yeah. I think those are the only two. Besides, I guess Lady Killer and Intollable Cruelty, which I think don't count to most people. Which are the ones that typically could kind of swept under the rug. Yeah. And I will say, I do kind of like Intollable Cruelty.

[00:07:01] I think that movie's kind of fun.

[00:07:03] Lady Killer is, you know, it's whatever.

[00:07:05] It can't be all, it can't all be.

[00:07:06] It's bad.

[00:07:07] You can sing.

[00:07:07] Yeah. huge, huge Coen Brothers fan, somebody who really grew up, especially in high school and college, really obsessing over the films of the Coen Brothers. And then for a long time, I still love the Coen Brothers, but it was one of those things where like, oh, I would check in once in a while, maybe rewatch an old favorite. This past summer at The Roxy, the Indian Theater in the Manhouse, from Zillow, Montana, where I also work, we did a series called Easy Coen, where we ended up playing more obscure side character. The rest of them are all fairly major characters. Mike D, how did you kind of approach your list? I started with the more obscure side characters. And then the more I was thinking about the movies, I was like, well, but it's gotta be the main character. Like I just, this the thing also, like almost every character is like so impactful

[00:09:40] in every scene that they're in,

[00:09:42] in the Coen's movies, that it's just like kind of hard

[00:09:44] to narrow down and be like, no, this is the best character

[00:09:47] or most interesting or most fun. I did kind of do the Mike D method of after rewatching several of them Redirecting that a little bit so there's some weird ones on here most notably number five and then they get more normal Okay, but my number five is from my favorite common brothers movie and that is Marty Randall First of all do either of you know who Marty Randall is that I mean that name rings a bell

[00:11:02] Because I think I've obviously seen the movie you be able to show up to see my interpretive dance? I'd love to hear your notes. And Jeff is like, Of course, I'll go see it. And then afterwards, he's like, also, it's the 10th.

[00:12:21] Whenever you get the chance to slip the rent under my Marty. So. Okay. That's what we know. Interesting. So I'm so glad that Marty Randall made the cut. He is your number five column brother's character of all time. Mike D, who is your number five?

[00:13:41] My number five is a character from a movie

[00:13:44] that I hadn't watched until I think this year or last year.

[00:13:46] No, when did we do? Tony Sloobes somebody who I think later in life, I realized like, oh, I love seeing this guy pop up in movies. So excited when he shows up. Yeah. And actually recently, I guess there was a new monk movie that just came out on Peacock. What? And I haven't watched Monk in like 15 years. Like, I didn't even finish Monk when it was airing on TV. But at the same time, I was like, man, I should watch that new monk movie.

[00:15:01] Do you think?

[00:15:02] Just announced the USA is like going to bring back

[00:15:04] all those shows.

[00:15:05] And so the characters are welcome back.

[00:15:06] Characters are welcome back. I think he's taking an interest. This is the worst thing that can happen to you. It's a... Thanks for really carrying the weight of my pick on that one, Mike. Of course, yeah, no, I love Barton Fink and I'm glad that you picked that one because I actually don't have any Barton Fink characters on my list. Wow. And I really, that feels like an oversight. The Barton Fink is my favorite of the movies. And yeah, Tony Sloob, so great in that movie.

[00:16:21] So yeah, what's the characters name again?

[00:16:23] Mike Paul Geisler?

[00:16:24] Ben Geisler.

[00:16:25] Ben Geisler, yeah, there you go.

[00:16:27] So that is Mike D's number five from Barton Fink. saddles. And then every once in a while, Shout's pan shot. He covers himself in pots and pans, and he's just firing at James Franco for a distance. It's just a wild performance from Steven Roode, who is one of those performers that I always like Tony Schlue. I always love seeing Steven Roode pop up in anything. And I think his performance in Busters Grugs is so funny, and does lead James Franco back to the end of his, like, his short, which is Cy Abelman from the movie A Serious Man. My number four is also Cy Abelman. Okay, I guess we can bounce back and forth with this one. I haven't seen A Serious Man, but the only thing I know about A Serious Man is Cy Abelman. So, this all tracks. I feel like there were like Mortal Kombat memes going around where they were like, they've

[00:19:02] added a new character, he's unbeatable and through it and just failing miserably by the handle most are sort of succeeding and then ultimately like kind of succumbing to his like base or urges. But yeah, Cy Abelman is this, you know, haunting figure

[00:20:21] that even when like about halfway through the movie,

[00:20:23] Cy Abelman is sort of out of the picture.

[00:20:25] Again, I'm trying to kind of avoid spoilers from like D.

[00:20:27] Even when he's sort of out of the picture, Yes, absolutely. So yeah, Saibman, both Nix and mine, number four pick for Coen Brothers characters. Mike D, who's your number four? My number four is also from the Ballad of Buster Scruggs, and that is Tom Waits as the prospector in the All Gold Canyon short. Nice, I had him as an honorable mention actually, yes. I was like, not really sure. I was like, I need to fill one in.

[00:21:41] Oh man, Buster Scruggs.

[00:21:42] And then of course it's like every other movie, you're like, what about this guy?

[00:21:45] What about this guy?

[00:21:46] And you run three, ten people. a larger-than-life Looney Tunes character. He's fantastic. You have Zoe Kazan's character who is so great, the girl who got rattled. Right. Right. But yeah, Tom Wigg's prospector, like Tom Wigg's is so funny and weird in that role. And there's the moment in that short where he gets shot and the other guy kind of comes in and starts digging where Tom Wigg's was digging.

[00:23:00] And then Tom Wigg gets up and shoots him.

[00:23:02] And he's like kind of shouting to the heavens like,

[00:23:04] he didn't sins washed away. So now he can, you know, be enlightened and just be a good guy. Yeah. He's the one that falls for the sirens, right? I think also. The sirens, yeah. Well, all three of them do fall for the sirens.

[00:24:21] But yeah, that whole scene's great.

[00:24:23] He's the one that thinks that John Tataro

[00:24:25] has turned into a toad.

[00:25:22] you know, you know, low key best one kind of thing. And which is crazy because I think it's their biggest failure

[00:25:25] as like a terrible box office flop and everything.

[00:25:28] Oh yeah, it did not do well when it came out.

[00:25:30] Yeah.

[00:25:30] Which is bananas, but also makes complete sense when you watch this movie.

[00:25:34] You're like, I don't even know if 2023 audiences would be ready for this kind of movie.

[00:25:39] So yeah, and Jennifer Jason Lee basically plays this like fast talking newspaper gal

[00:25:44] who's on the story and is going to find the two cab driver guys that are in the diner watching her do the con to Tim Rains because they just narrate what she's doing and she's doing it by the book. And then the payoff to that later when she tells Bruce Campbell that she did this whole

[00:27:00] song and dance story and he's like, adenoids and she's like, no, Lumbago, which is the

[00:27:03] same thing with the cab driver's guy.

[00:27:05] We're like, whoa, she's going with Lumbago. Steven Soderbergh, like found to George Clooney, is casting him as the coolest guy on Earth. And the key that the Coen brothers found to George Clooney is casting him as the guy who thinks he's the coolest guy. Or thinks he's the smartest one in the room. And that is very much, at least he's Everett McGill. He is fast talking. He is sort of the leader of this

[00:28:21] group with him, Tim Blake Nelson, John Tutturo. And he's really funny and it's clear that no matter what kind of supernatural craziness happens to him, he can find a way to rationalize it in some kind of pseudo-intellectual way. And yeah, he's so good at making himself seem like the smartest one in the room, when he's clearly also one of the dumbest. And there's so many just funny moments involving that character. So yeah, Ulysses Everett McGill,

[00:29:41] over the art thou, he's my number three.

[00:29:43] Hell yeah.

[00:29:44] Great pick.

[00:29:44] Yeah.

[00:29:45] I mean, it's one of those things that like,

[00:29:46] all these movies also are, to borrow a phrase, Nick, who's your choice? My number two choice is Oscar Isaac as Lewin Davis in the movie Inside Lewin Davis. Nice, I have this as an honorable mention as well. Okay, we're at not for Big Lebowski. I think this would be my favorite Cowen Brothers movie, but again, I'll rewatch No Country for Old Men like next week and probably bump that one up six spaces. So who really knows?

[00:31:00] Right, yeah.

[00:31:01] But I don't know, I just,

[00:31:02] this is a very interesting point

[00:31:04] because I feel like the most,

[00:31:05] like the last decade of Cowen Brothers stuff having not seen it since it came out. And it was immediately like, this is a top three, come on, brother's movie. Like this is real high up there. It's basically perfect. Like it almost, it was one of those movies that's like so good that it almost made you mad. Like at how good it was. And Oscar Isaac is just incredible as Lou and Davis. And also kind of makes you mad as like, what's he been up to? Like what's he wasted his time in Star Wars 4?

[00:32:21] Come on, get back to doing this kind of stuff.

[00:32:24] Yeah, no, it's,

[00:32:25] he's incredible as Lou and Davis.

[00:32:27] And I think this movie is really funny. to this past summer. I don't see a lot of money here. It's just after he pours his heart and soul into singing the song. And then just the button at the end, we're like, oh, we're essentially, we're literally starting the, or ending the movie exactly where it started. So the cycle's repeating, and Bob Dylan is there. So it's just like, he literally cannot make his way out of this. Yes, yeah, absolutely.

[00:33:40] And despite it being like devastating

[00:33:42] at all those points and stuff,

[00:33:43] like there's still stuff like Please Mr. Kennedy,

[00:33:45] which is like the most delightful thing

[00:33:46] that's ever been filmed.

[00:33:48] Absolutely. inside the wind Davis is Nick's number like, this could be said in five words, but we're gonna make it take 20. Whatever sentence they're saying is amazing. So yeah, she's so great. And I think it was also her debut, at least her first feature film. Yeah, no, it was Haley Steinfeld's debut film. And honestly, I don't think she was in much for a while after that. Like I think it was like six years until I saw her in something.

[00:36:20] Yeah.

[00:36:21] Like after True Grit.

[00:36:22] Like I think she was in, she was in Pitch Perfect 2.

[00:36:24] Yeah.

[00:36:24] Which was like 2015, but then I didn't see that at the time.

[00:36:27] I saw, I next saw it in a very long time. And when I think of it now, I'm like, oh yeah, Jeff Bridges, Rooster Cogburn. Like that's the thing. But I completely forgot like how great Hailey Sandfeld was in that movie. Like she was just like a firecracker in it. She's amazing. And yeah, Barry Pepper is just like this gross cowboy guy. And so it's 10 out of 10 movie, like all the other ones.

[00:37:42] Yes, honestly, the thing that I remember

[00:37:44] the most about True Grit is,

[00:37:46] I think it's Jeff Bridges and Hailey Sandfeld Master Gardener, Paul Schrader's new movie, spoilers not gonna make my top 10. So no pressure guys. But Nick, who's your choice for your number one Coenbrothers character of all time? Norville Barnes, no.

[00:40:21] It's the idea, man. Yeah, so this is where the list gets the most away from me

[00:40:25] from when I was trying to pick smaller characters

[00:40:28] and more of the scene. And the fact that half of her detective work is done while she's eating and stuff like that, it just makes her feel like a human character beyond a lot of comedic pastitias that a lot of background characters get in other common brothers movies. And she's just a well of positivity.

[00:41:42] And specifically that lasts two minutes of Fargo

[00:41:45] where she looks at Norm when. She's number one, yeah, well, yeah, exactly. And I was like, wait for it, first pass through with all the weird side character stuff, and then I was like, no, it's gotta be March. Yeah, she's a perfect character, she's amazing. This is one of those movies Fargo is one of those movies that somehow just like made itself into like

[00:43:00] a foundational text amongst my friend groups,

[00:43:03] and in particular, my college friends and stuff,

[00:43:05] and producer Colin.

[00:43:06] We were always just saying like,

[00:43:08] I think I've told this before, You son of a coward. I'm sorry, guys. Is it norm? No, it's not norm. I actually did have Norm as an Arnold mention. Nice. And I actually almost put Mikey on a guitar, honestly, as well. Yeah, as well. But yeah, Fargo is a movie that I really love. It's great. But for me, it's never been as foundational as some other comic brothers movies.

[00:44:20] There are other movies that I like a lot more than Fargo

[00:44:23] that I've re-watched many more times.

[00:44:25] So I did re-watch Fargo this past summer

[00:44:27] as part of Easy Cohen. is again rewatching it this past summer for the first time in a while. And that was when I had rewatched more recently, like I had watched it. I had shown this movie to my girlfriend in like 2019, because my costume that year for Halloween was H.I. McDonough from Raisinger so nice. But I rewatched it this summer with a sold out crowd, and it was just the biggest smile on my face the entire time.

[00:45:40] It was such a perfect screening.

[00:45:42] And it was so great to rewatch this movie and kind of really luck into

[00:45:46] Nick Cage's performance again and Holly Hunter's performance again. I don't know. Neither of them, the McDonald's, made my list because I could not pick who was my favorite and I didn't want to represent one without representing the other. Specifically, just quick shout out for Edwina. When they steal the baby and she looks at him for the first time and just goes, I love him so and just bursts into tears.

[00:47:01] Just crying, yeah.

[00:47:02] Yeah.

[00:47:03] Immediately I'm like, I don't give a shit at their criminals.

[00:47:05] They're good people.

[00:47:06] It's fun.

[00:47:07] Yeah. Five through one was Marty Randall, the landlord from Bigelbowski at number five, Cy Abelman, the one and only at number four from a serious man, Delmar O'Donnell from O'Brother War Art Thou at number three, Lewin Davis from Inside Lewin Davis at number two, and number one, Marge Gunderson from Fargo. There you go, Mike D, who are your five? My five was

[00:48:20] at number five Ben Ge an Oscar for Bart Fink

[00:49:42] Like he should have gotten it for that one, you know, but also for the Bousky. He's one of mine. I could just start listing 75 other characters, so I'm gonna cut myself off right here. Fair enough, fair enough. Mike D, who are your honorable mentions? I was thinking originally John Polito in which one. Ian Miller's Crossing as Johnny Casper, who's the rival crime boss guy

[00:51:00] that kind of kicks off the whole plot

[00:51:02] because it's a question of ethics, you understand.

[00:51:05] And he's so fun.

[00:51:06] And he's one of those guys that's in a lot of the same thing.

[00:51:08] He's in a lot of their movies, there for me, Walter from the big Lebowski, who is, you know, is so so funny in that movie. And then also, honestly, I could fill this with just big Lebowski characters. You sure from the whole filmography and stuff, but Walter from Lebowski, Julianne Moore in Lebowski, David Thulez in Lebowski, just sitting in the corner and laughing.

[00:52:21] But the other Lebowski one that I is so funny. So yeah, Philip Sierra Hoffman is brand is one for me. Lewin Davis also an all mentioned for me. Like Nick mentioned, Hobie Doyle from Hail Caesar, who is Alton Aronwike's character, the singing cowboy who has the iconic Wood that a torso simple scene. I was just kidding. I know, yeah. Which is so great between him and Ray Fines.

[00:53:42] You know, he's just like a simple guy who, you know,

[00:53:45] is trying to be like, he's a cowboy actor

[00:53:47] who gets kind of cast into this sort of phone call and he writes on the notepad and he's like, I gotta take this and he walks out of the room and dude runs over with the pencil and traces over it. It's just a giant wang. It's just a drag of a dick on the notepad. It's one of the funniest five seconds in a movie of all time. I don't understand anything about it, but I wanted to highlight the wang picture that Ben Gazzard draws. In fact, fantastic.

[00:55:02] I'm gonna give one more shout out also

[00:55:04] to Brad Pitt in Burn After Reading,

[00:55:06] who is very, very funny.

[00:55:07] I watched that once when I was maybe like freshman in college and haven't seen since, but I thought it was like solid. It was pretty good. I'll throw out Sam Raimia as that one cop in Miller's Crossing. Oh yeah, he just got to follow us. So far. He's so far as. I always forget that they were like connected, you know, that they, the Coens of Sam Raimian. Yeah, Joel Cohen was an editor on the Evil Dead.

[00:56:22] Right.

[00:56:22] And yeah, they made crime wave together.

[00:56:24] And yeah, they were very closely associated

[00:56:26] for a very long time until is great. Of course. Yeah, thank you so much for having me on. This did bring about a crisis of how much of a movie do I need to watch before I can rank it on Letterbox again. Cause I would say I watched about 50 minutes of 10 different Coen brothers movies to prepare for this

[00:57:41] but I only logged two of the movies

[00:57:42] that I watched in full.

[00:57:44] So what do you guys cut off?

[00:57:46] I would say you have to watch the whole movie. who plays the flute and there's a whole thing where all the different, like fish are playing different instruments, but because it's like meant to be realistic, none of the fish are playing instruments and none of them are dancing, it sucks. They're not as brave as Aquaman, which had a giant octopus play the drums. Exactly, and that's why Aquaman 2 is gonna make a billion dollars. That's a success.

[00:59:02] But there you go, yeah,

[00:59:03] let's rank Coenborough's characters.

[00:59:04] We did it and it was Nick's idea.

[00:59:06] So yeah, once again, Nick, thank you for this.

[00:59:08] Have it help. on new Twitter without Nazis yet. Astris, we'll see what happens at that. You can also donate to support the show at our CoVY page, which is CoVY.com slash Mike at Mike Pods. And if you want to donate $50, you can pick an episode or be our friend. We can pick a topic for us to cover, donate $50 on CoVY and we'll do it.

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[01:00:25] That's right.

[01:00:26] And you can find me online at MSmithFilmblog by Bob Clark, director of a Christmas story. And Mike D is gonna be making me watch Roland Emmerich's 2012. So from 2019. From 2009. 2009, yeah. So some disparate quality levels I think happening here between the two movies that's. Yeah, one of you drew the short straw here. Yeah, we'll see.

[01:01:40] We'll see which one, you know?

[01:01:42] We'll see.

[01:01:43] We will certainly see.

[01:01:44] I am sort of interested in watching it.

[01:01:46] I mean, I kinda wanted to Oh man, you should watch it. It's really good. Okay. Did you like Poe as a Frayed?

[01:03:00] I did.

[01:03:01] I loved Poe as a Frayed.

[01:03:02] You're in, baby.

[01:03:02] Okay.

[01:03:03] Nice.

[01:03:04] If there's any show times near me, I'll be there.

[01:03:06] Yes, absolutely.

[01:03:08] Is Poe as a Frayed gonna make your 10 Nick? Fair enough. And Nick, you might be back in the podcast in a couple of weeks. We're going to do an in-person episode. We're kind of still deciding sort of. I'm going to put a text out to the group and see who's around and what they want to talk about. But there's a few different options that are on the table. And so yeah, we'll be doing an in-person episode and hopefully we'll see you there. Nick, I'm happy to be there unless I have to rewatch FastX or something.

[01:04:21] That would be the funniest thing if we just talked about FastX again.

[01:04:24] Actually, you'd get one empty audio file and that'd be for me sitting silently